- cross-posted to:
- pleasantpolitics@slrpnk.net
- cross-posted to:
- pleasantpolitics@slrpnk.net
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This was one of the main reasons why I was looking forward to Harris winning … so that everyone in the world could just stop talking about dumb American politics for a while
Now it looks like it’s all we’ll ever talk about at the expense of talking about every other important thing in the world … such as our long term survival as a species on this planet.
The unfortunate truth is that a Trump win is relevant to our long term survival as a species. He’s likely to push anti-pollution deregulation, prioritize fossil fuels, refuse to uphold international agreements on climate change policy, etc. That’s on top of the damage he will do to international trade, charitable efforts, world health, immigration, and war. He is far from the only problem in all of those areas, but unfortunately he’s likely to be involved with just about all of it, and improve none of it. As an American, I’m so so sorry.
“Drill baby drill, frack baby frack”.
Trumps literal words at a rally leading up to the election. And people cheered.
This should tell you all you need to know. If you recycle, if you carpool, if you use public transportation. If you have a compost pile. If you refuse to buy plastic water bottles, and styrofoam plates. If you do everything you can to reduse, reuse, and recycle, fuck you. Your efforts are in vein. All of it is being undone on a global industrial scale. Purposefully. With tax breaks for the oil tycoons who pollute the most.
This is what we’re in for.
To be fair I explicitly remember Harris saying she heavily supported tracking in the debate. I think the US local pollution will increase much faster than the global pollution.
The unfortunate truth is that a Trump win is relevant to our long term survival as a species.
You actually missed the biggest thing of all. Trump’s new world disorder is going to create an explosion of nuclear proliferation. In the new environment, countries can no longer rely on the US nuclear umbrella as they have for the past 70 years. Every country will rightly want to have their own nuclear weapons now. And the shear amount of new countries that are going to have their own nuclear weapons is going to guarantee a disaster sooner or later.
I hope you’re wrong, this is fucking terrifying.
That ball started rolling in 2014 when we did fucking NOTHING in response to Russia annexing Crimea. Seriously, I consider that one moment to be Obama’s most catastrophic foreign policy failure.
And this is now why Ukraine has openly said they’re considering a crash nuclear weapons program - which they can do, because they had a lot of former Soviet personnel that operated and maintained Soviet nukes back in the day, and a lot of very fucking motivated and intelligent citizens who would absolutely love it if they could make Russia fuck off from their territory for good.
Nukes are the absolute final word in maintaining sovereignty and territorial integrity. Ukraine would not be getting invaded now if they still had a few warheads stashed in a bunker being quietly maintained. But they signed the Budapest Memorandum, and gave them up in exchange for “security guarantees and assurances” which were ultimately thrown on the floor. Nobody will EVER make that deal again.
TL;DR: Nuclear proliferation is back with a vengeance, baby!
We’re gonna fucking blow ourselves off the face of the earth, all because a few dudes just couldn’t stop trying to obtain power. How disgusting.
Good, maybe it’ll end quickly then, rather than this long, drawn out, slow cooking…
Heck they even were saying they want to nuke Mars. Oh wait, I mean lie about their reason for putting nukes in space
Cartels will have nukes shortly after smaller countries with weak or bribable security forces have them.
As the POTUS, Trump gets to set the bar on the world stage for international cooperation in many parts of life.
Other leaders, world-wide, will follow his lead, either because they can finally get away with it, or in reaction to how he treats their nation.
We saw this to a small degree with Trump 1.0 when nobody expected him to win. Now the entire world has had 8 years to figure out what they are going to do.
Don’t worry, nothing will be done to stop him (till he’s in a bunker if you catch my drift.)
Long-term fate was sealed with this election.
Short-term profit year over year for the shareholders always wins.
Sadly, a few protests now is nothing in comparison if Harris would have won. The Republican party already had preemptive lawsuits to challenge the election results before election day and the results would have been contended for months. There was a high likelihood of a repeat of Jan. 6th 2021 on Jan. 6th 2025 from right wing milita groups.
Americans would rather bully the entire world than participate in it apparently. We’re stuck with this now. The Republican party is back from the dead.
Funny that Musk supports “long-termism” and yet helped get Trump into office. A real face-eating leopards moment.
While I fully support these protests, they need to be planning for the responding violence from authorities. It’s coming the day Trump takes office.
People protesting in Seattle or NYC are, rest assured, taking state sanctioned violence into account. SPD/NYPD are a great way to train a culture in how to mitigate absolute bastards.
Maybe I should get started on that LRAD deflector…
Probably best to stick to coordinating movements to isolate and neutralize paid provocateurs and provide secure wellness stations, while maintaining a recording of EVERYTHING done by officials. Remember to broadcast everything, not just record. That way recordings can’t be seized.
At some point they’ll start shutting down internet access to prevent recording of their actions. But that will probably coincide to when protest isn’t the most efficient of methods any more.
At some point they’ll start shutting down internet access to prevent recording of their actions
This is an interesting viewpoint. I think the internet is where the modern GOP has their strongest control over people. Yeah, there is traditional media, but the internet echo chambers are where a lot of their people go to express their beliefs. Shutting it all down would be severing a link that directly guides the populace’s minds. (Especially for the younger folks who don’t know a life without internet.)
Imagine no more Xitter propaganda, no more ignorant Facebook posts, no hate-inspiring memes propagating at the speed of light… Conspiracy theories and gossip would become localized again, and since the people inclined toward those things can’t independently determine reality, over time their viewpoints would inevitably diverge from each other.
I mean, a lot of things could happen, ranging from violent reactions, to increased empathy (from being forced to interact with diverse neighbors in-person.) But without a central command link, a brain to tell them what to believe, the tribal nature of their supporters would invariably cause fractures within their own base.
(At least, one can hope.)
They won’t shut it all down, just localized areas in order to ‘protect the safety of officers operating in the area’.
You mean a rifle?
Got that covered!
And searches for “can I change my vote” and “what is a tariff” have spiked
Everyone has been warning against Trump (including his own ex staff and lawyers).
Big thanks to the donkeys though who promoted Trump and tried to pretend Kamala is the same.
I doubt there is a single economist that believes in Trump
Get ready because next year they going make protesting illegal, and Trump already signal his willingness to send troops to said protest. I suspect we will have protest and soldiers shooting said protesters. People under estimate how many mega have joined the army.
If making protesting illegal is enough to get you to stop protesting: You’re not really upset enough to have protested in the first place for anything but taking pictures of it for social media points.
And it’s not like protesters haven’t been getting shot or beaten up by police even while it’s legal.
That’s why I would advise against directly confrontation means of protest. Instead look at things like malicious compliance, boycotts, 4B / birthstrike, anticonsumption, and other acts of non-participation. Labor strikes will probably be common, but those can be rather risky.
Governments know how to deal in violence. Don’t give them a target to aim at.
Yep. They knew what would happen because we’ve been telling them for months what would happen. Trump himself has been telling them for months what would happen. But they’re too smart. They always seem to know more than those they disagree with.
And now, because of a single issue that’s happing in a country where most of them couldn’t have located on a map a year ago- we’re now having to deal with the worst possible outcome.
And here’s the kicker-
What’s happening at that place that they could locate on a map a year ago that upset them so much will not be happening for too much longer…
and it won’t be ending in a way they’d have hoped it would.
But just wait… it’ll be everyone else’s fault.
The sad part is that everything bad he says is apparently “him joking”. Like the Mafia, he knows exactly what he’s doing as well when it comes to coercion. He doesn’t threaten people, he just says it would be a pity if it happened
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The new narrative is “I have no culpability whatsoever when it comes to Trump winning just because I kept repeating that no one should vote for Harris. It’s entirely her fault for running a bad campaign.”
They refuse to share blame. I hope they feel just as self-righteous when they’re getting marched into that boxcar.
Please show me a single example of somepne saying that Harris was the same as trump.
Take a stroll through hexbear and .Ml
I see all these comments roasting the protestors, but I’m just glad people are angry. It would have been great if the election went differently, but it didn’t, and we are where we are. Support people getting mad with how things turned out. Stop acting like all these people did nothing until now. I voted, and I’m protesting. I’ll happily welcome non voters in the protests too. Turn your frustration and anger against the people you oppose instead of willing allies.
Yeah. The best time to do this was a week ago. The next best time is for the next four years
Stop acting like all these people did nothing until now
Well no, they did do something.
They voted for Trump.
Something something chickens something something home to roost and all that.
I highly doubt the people protesting Trump voted for him.
Come on.
But we should certainly accept anyone who has had a true change of heart in voting for Trump and regrets it or even felt pressured to vote that way in the first place.
Apparently thier distaste for the man didn’t involve giving a shit enough to stop him from taking power.
Normally I would agree. However these people will have to live through and experience the reality of it all.
If that doesn’t wake them up then we truly are fucked.
I understand wanting to protest, but what could it possibly accomplish? If you are protesting the incoming administration, they’re certainly not going to care. If you’re protesting the current administration, there’s nothing they can do. If you’re protesting the people who didn’t vote, I’m pretty sure they already know we’re mad at them. As of yet there’s no evidence of outright cheating (if it turns out there is, that would be a better time to protest). But protesting just because you don’t like the results of a race is a bit like throwing a tantrum.
People who say protests are useless should be cursed with diarrhea farts every time they sneeze
Maybe the point of the protest is to bring awareness to the public?
Awareness of what? As badly informed as most people are, I’m still certain that most Americans know Trump won.
I’m all for protests, and lord knows we will be needing them, but protests should have some kind of coherent demands. The left wastes a ton of energy spinning it’s wheels.
Maybe the point of the protest is to bring awareness to the public?
Maybe. How useful is “awareness”?
When I look at the biggest protests in the US there’s plenty of awareness about around all the biggest protests. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_protests_and_demonstrations_in_the_United_States_by_size
Going down that list, it’s hard to find evidence that the awareness got us anywhere.
- George Floyd - We keep saying his name. Has there been any change in police violence or accountability?
- Earth day - We’ve been talking about this forever and we keep breaking records on extreme weather events.
- 2017 Women’s March - We just elected the chief pussy grabber.
- March for Our Lives - Guns are still everywhere.
- 2018 Women’s March - See number 3.
- RickyRenunicia - I have to pass on this one. I have no idea what the state of corruption in PR is.
- Great American Boycott - Democrats switched to agreeing with Republicans on immigration.
- LGB - You can reasonably argue that sexuality related rights have improved. It’s not clear that this protest was a particular catalyst for that. If we want to pin things on a single event, Stonewall probably had a bigger impact.
- Anti Nuclear - More countries than ever believe they need nukes to survive. We’re now unironically talking about the use of tactical nuclear weapons.
- Million Man March - See number 1
I could go on, but the track record for the 10 biggest protests isn’t great.
Whatever you say, diarrhea farts
You can type all that but not do even a tiny bit of research to look at thousands of examples worldwide and in history?
https://now.org/about/history/history-of-marches-and-mass-actions/
It’s cute that you can call me names.
Can you also articulate positive changes that have resulted from the 10 biggest protest?
Women’s Suffrage was fairly significant and the Civil Rights movement also used protests. Then in the 2000s people rose up against the canceling of Firefly and demanded a movie as compensation. Serenity was that movie and it was awesome and it remains amazing.
Finally, internationally one man named Gandhi used nonviolence to defeat the British empire.
Then in the 2000s people rose up against the canceling of Firefly and demanded a movie as compensation
lmao
Women’s Suffrage (and additional rights) and the Civil Rights movement both had many successes. They also used many tactics and strategies besides protests and that makes it hard to attribute their success to protests. That’s why I looked at the 10 largest protests in the US on Wikipedia. There’s obviously some subjectivity to which protests are the most salient but it’s fair to assume that a large number of those should actually be the most important protests. The fact that we didn’t see progress as a response to any of the biggest protests suggests that they don’t have much of an impact.
I view the Firefly situation a bit differently too. We actually wanted them to bring Firefly back as a show. As near as I can tell Joss made the movie (which I agree was and still is awesome) because he loved the story and wanted to finish it. He may have been uplifted by the support of the fans but he didn’t give in to anyone’s demands. Fans kept badgering him to pick the series up after the movie and argued that the success of the movie proved that the series would make money but he told us that wasn’t possible because too many of the actors where on other projects. I have to admit that Summer Glau made a pretty good terminator.
Ghandi is an interesting case. He also used many tactics and strategies beyond protest and he was dealing with a very different situation. Their oppressor was thousands of miles away and got a bit tied up with bigger problems. There is also a strong academic consensus that he likely delayed Indian independence.
It’s not me that needs to write that history essay, it’s you. I’m not doing your work for you. Try reading a book.
How about you can the “I’m-not-gonna-do-your-work-for-you” shit and just answer the question, if you can? Because it sounds like you’re just trying to save face because he has your ass over a barrel and you know it.
Maybe we should stop being in denial about how useless the left is in this country and actually organize into an effective voting block.
I don’t know man, I’m still an amateur on this whole scene, admittedly. I do know that when my loved ones are put at risk I’m not just going to shrug and say, “guess this is just how it’s gonna be, voters voted for it.” It’s unsurprisingly feeling just like the last time Trump was in power. I happen to be of a demographic that is at minimal risk personally, but my neighbors are being threatened and their property has been vandalized with hate speech. They’re scared to leave the house. I’ve got family and friends being told they don’t deserve to have the same rights as everyone else and targeted by open acts of hatred. A lot of Americans may have voted in support of this kind of thing, but that doesn’t mean I’m going to just shut up, roll over, and accept it. If that’s considered throwing a tantrum, then okay. I would expect anyone to throw such a tantrum in the same kind of circumstances, including my political opposites.
Where did I say you should roll over and accept it or do nothing? The only thing I said was that protest won’t change anything, specifically right now. There are plenty of other things you can do besides protest.
Personally, if we get to a point where there’s an organized multi-state secessionist movement, I’ll join that army in a heartbeat to try to take back at least part of our country. We’re not at that point yet.
I mean as an American it’s still technology my right.
They get to go to reeducation camp first!
Wonderful timing! Did you ever consider doing this a week or two ago?
If the people had rallied far more before the election, it could have convinced enough ignorant fence sitters. Now we have people reacting to damage already done when the next chance to fix it is two years away.
It would have been worse. Fox News would paint them as anarchists and encourage violence. Nothing would change on the right
Yeah, it would have just been feeding their infinitely expandable persecution fetish. The same goes for the legal cases against Trump. It was the right thing to do, but it just meant that Trump supporters dug in their heels even more.
If the people had rallied far more before the election, it could have convinced enough ignorant fence sitters.
The exact same thing happened in 2016. Huge rallies a few days after Clinton lost. If those same street rallies had come a few days BEFORE the election, she probably would have won.
Of course, there is the distinct possibility that the rallies were happening before the election. The billionaire owned media just didn’t choose to show it until now.
I was thinking that too. It’s definitely possible.
To be fair, I imagine most of these people voted.
This is a good lesson to those who are shocked by the win but didn’t vote.
“Huh. I threw away my vote and now they’re talking about implementing Project 2025 during Trump’s revenge administration! Weird…”
None of this makes sense anymore. How could people possibly be shocked this time? It happened before under less favorable circumstances.
Wasn’t the time to protest like before the election? Can’t figure the US line of reasoning
I think Trump’s strategy was “I’m going to sound so crazy every Democrat will assume I’ll lose and don’t bother voting”.
And it worked.
TWICE
both times dem consultants took the bait and courted republicans. Though this is the first time right wing immigration policies were pushed by the democrat.
Hillary campaigns with Kissinger, Harris campaigns with the Cheneys, and then Democrats wonder why no one trusts them.
The only reason the DNC couldn’t get Kissinger for this election is that he couldn’t get a weekend pass from hell.
That’s how it was for me except I did vote. But I was so confident we had it in the bag.
Well, at a certain point, “just don’t be that big a dumbass” has to happen because things really can’t stay together otherwise. Assuming he couldn’t win is a perfectly sensible assumption. You can lead 73 million horses to water but you can’t make them drink.
A mandate of hate.
It worked all right. Now we have to deal with it
They were protesting before the election. You just weren’t paying attention
Or voting against a racist and facist for oval office.
Remember if you’re going to any protests. Don’t bring your phone and wear a mask. Use a map if you’re not familiar with the area, write any important numbers you might need to call from a cell on your arm. Let friends know where you’re going and don’t go alone if you can.
Why no phone? Also is it still that bad with CoVid, that even outside a mask is necessary?
It’s about anonymity. You can be tracked through your phone, and of course, by your face.
I guess I’m spoiled by my (yet working) european liberal democracy. No idea it got that bad that you need to worry about such things…
you should always worry about it operationally. even in europe.
If things are bad enough to be worth a protest then it’s probably always best to be at least a bit cautious, and your phone is one of the worst possible things you could have on you.
Because they are protesting someone who wants to make protesting illegal. Better to protest now without a phone and a mask, so you don’t get shot in the legg when he gets in power in January
I think it’s more to avoid facial recognition
March and rally to protest Trump and the two-party war machine
Mass protests against the two-party system. Perhaps we can get some actual representation next election.
There isn’t going to be another election, not a real one anyway. It’s game over.
For starters, his first speech on 1A basically says he’s prosecuting anyone who dares to enforce the Hatch Act.
And he’ll probably put into effect the insurrection act.
Civil disorder feels like a broad term. You could probably label occupy wallstreet or the women’s March of 2016 as such.
Funny. Assuming there actually is a next time.
Imagine being stupid enough to protest democracy, assist a wannabe dictator become the next US president, and still bitching about a two party system system. Because of ignorance and stupidity there will only be single party going forward in America.
Fascism like the world has never seen.
This shit is so self-defeating, anti-progressive and only inflicts damage on the truly innocent people
But hey principles ami right?
Hey Bud. You okay?
This reads like you’re feeling defeated. It’s okay to have hope that the world can get better, even if it feels like the dark days.
You anthropomorphizing complex socio-polotical effects of a rotting economic system. Just thought you ought to know.
If it’s any consolation, at least Trump can only ever become a short term dictator, because he’s old.
I doubt even the MAGAs would support Vance or any other republican trying to maintain a dictatorship. The entire GOP will crumble in infighting when Trump is gone and probably even beforehand.
This is the kind of clownish thinking that got us in this position in the first place. Stop underestimating the orange idiot.
Or his cadre of evil clowns.
monkey paw curls
The two party system is over
couldve been louder a couple months ago
“Hate never made America great” ? What the fuck are you even talking about? Your hate of commies launched you to the moon and made you a nuclear superpower. Your hate of the religious freedom in Europe caused you to invade another continent and cause genocide upon its inhabitants. Your hate of black people sparked a civil war that almost destroyed you as a country.
Hate is what defines you. As a reminder of the hate you perpetuate, your majority chose hate of women and minorities instead of throwing a known criminal in jail. Trump is the US. Hate is the US.
Our hate of fascism led us to put Hitler in a corner so dark he took his own life because the commies we hated so much would’ve done so much worse to him like Mussolini. I think you have misrepresented our hatred of commies, since this is just one part of our history; we work with the commies whenever it’s convenient and then when it’s peaceful we make a pissing contest for the sake of flexing on one another like petty stepbrothers. Hate is a big part of our history, yes, but it’s ignorant to think of this as the whole face of America.
And before anyone says “America joined WWII late,” I want to say that’s a lie by omission most of the time. It’s true that America put troops on the ground only after Pearl Harbor…but the US government was already sending supplies to the allies before that; for the entire duration of the war, the US had an anti-Nazi government. Hypocritically so due to the US policies against black people, but some people phrase it in a way that makes it sound like they want us to believe the US was close to joining the Axis before Pearl Harbor (also bringing up the MSG rally, which…you could find a comparable amount of Nazis in any Western country at the time.) Anti-interventionism was the absolute norm in the US at the time.
Now, it is incorrect that US History class casts Americans as the primary heroes of WWII.
instead of throwing a known criminal in jail.
All they had to do is throw in jail is correct. But no, they kept him around and used him as the “orange boogyman” so they can campaign without campaign promises.
As an Italian who lived through three different Berlusconi’s governments… there is no way back. Identity politics is too yummy for lobbies and the other people who fund politicians.
What should someone even do to respond to a viewpoint like this?
I mean, some support of reform in your congress and senate would be a good answer. Allowance from people outside the two anointed parties to come forward and propose good ideas even if they don’t affiliate themselves with the oligarchs running things in the republican and democratic parties - fix that First Past The Post bullshit, you all know it’s bad for you. Reform of how you count votes, gerrymandering is literally destroying your elections. Reform of how many representatives there are for each state - you’re telling me even though California has 17 million more people than Florida, they have the same number of senators? Or maybe it’d be nice if your cops wouldn’t be above the law and always getting away with murdering minorities, that would help. Or maybe reform of your education and healthcare systems, which feed all your money in the pockets of the same fucks who then force you into labor for the “luxury” of taking an ambulance to the hospital when you’re sick, or earning a higher education. Reform of your for-profit prison system that jails minorities to further increase your class divide. Or reform of your diplomatic relations with countries known for genocide. Reform of so many different things… But I think most of all, it would really have sent a message if instead of making him president, you’d have just jailed the convicted felon that has ties to one of your biggest enemies. Cause otherwise you’re just painting the picture that corruption has overtaken you.
And hey, it’s not you as a person that is responsible for any of this. But this is how it looks like from the outside. Your majority has decided you’re gonna be corrupt fucks for the next few years and that you as a nation are gonna exchange the lives of women for a red hat and a fake tan. If that’s what the majority decides, that’s the impression your country will leave. I’m truly sorry about it for the many actually reasonable people that are left. Perhaps now is a good time to consider emigration.
yall had your chance. fucked around and found out.
I still support the protests but, jesus christ, this fucking mess is only just beginning.
I get the feeling we need to be doing the work the Democrats refused to do: creating a political mandate. Protesting is part of creating that mandate, but one thing I would like to see is the inverse of the “ground game” l; where instead of going door to door to convince people of a solution, you get them involved in the decision process.
creating a political mandate
My friend, we just created a political mandate. Unfortunately, it was for literal fascists.
Any type of “strategy” as it were is moot now.
americans are awful at protesting. they show up, cant figure out where to park, have no organizations, have lame chants (e.g. hey hey, ho ho, donald trump has go to go), present the same meaningless meme protest posters, leave tons of trash behind, and it last a few hours. Nothing is sustained for multiple days or weeks, and the solidarity is with people who already were with you.
So accurate. Attention span issues.
H A S T O G O
Donald Trump has got to go!
They should ship in French people. They are first class protestors.
