Funny, when Europe does this, it’s called “socialism”.
Can you imagine the screams of, “COMMUNISM!!!” If Obama or Biden had done this. It’s all we would hear about for an entire election cycle. Fox “News” would play it nonstop.
Didn’t Obama do it for GM and a bunch of other companies as part of a bailout package for a period of time?
So did Bush. It’s only bad when their enemies do it. It’s righteous and just when they do it.
So if I’m reading that right they set for $700 billion worth of purchase during the Bush admin, it got reduced to 426.4 billion by 2014 and they claimed they made $15.3 billion. It sounds like they made a 3.5% gain on their investment total. A win! Yay… Only if you ignore the fact that if that money went in from 2009-2024, the money averages out on inflation to have been worth 481.29 billion. A loss of $12.15 billion dollars if they would have done anything else with it.
Overall I wouldn’t be mad that they wasted that money if they had focused on structuring the company moving forward in a manner that wouldn’t end up supporting a wealth divide moving forward. The CEO “only” had a salary of $2.1 million in 2024. Which actually sounds mildly alright. Yet her take home was $29.5 million when they got done throwing stocks and bonuses at her. That’s after GM stock started 2024 at $55.50… and ended the year at $35.64.
So the company lost ~36% of its “worth” and she got more than 13x her salary in stock and bonuses.
I was wondering recently if the idea of opportunity cost is the same for governments that can print their own money versus all other entities. I’m not entirely clear on how the that automaker bailouts were financed but would that money even have existed if they hadn’t used it for the bailout? It’s not like the government was going to create that amount of money and put it in a savings account.
A more appropriate way to look at it might be whether the money earned more than it cost the government to service the debt. IIRC servicing government debt is not inflation-adjusted, so it’s probably more informative to compare it to the cost of the debt not inflation adjusted-growth.
But this gets pretty weird since it’s not how finance works for entities that cannot print their own money.
Ah but a bailout package is different. That’s a display of powerful capitalism. A private company so powerful it can’t be allowed to fail and a government so strong it won’t allow it to fail.
It was Bush just before he left office.
Yes, but it’s not socialism we’re seeing. It’s fascism. Fascism also has state control of private industry. For a different purpose.
And when China and Arab states do it, it’s something to aspire.
Yes and no. In this context, it’s more of a shakedown-sorta thing.
Seems like the government owning private industry might stray into the socialism thing thy hate. Why not do this with something more important like healthcare? Republicans are hypocrites.
It’s only socialism when democrats do it.
deleted by creator
Healthcare could help, that’s good socialism. Intel is profits and power and control for the sake of it. That’s bad socialism.
That way when things fuck up they can point and go SEE SEE IT DOESNT WORK! WE TRIED IT AND IT MADE THINGS WORSE!!
and if it somehow does manage to help or improve things they can now claim they did something smart and take all the credit.
Well, no. In this case it’s probably Intel is collapsing I assume, and they’re the only CPU producer native to the US. It’d be a really bad thing strategically to let them fail, so they should be nationalized.
Yeah, but then poor people would use it.
We’ve always had communism for the rich and cutthroat capitalism for the working class
Our healthcare system in the US is Socialism, only the government funds the corporations with subsidies, not paying outright for the citizens. It’s a man in the middle system where they stick a middle finger up your ass to get money from you three times. With taxes, with insurance, and with actual medical care.
If you ask, they’ll tell you it’s different for ‘essential services’. It’s the same excuse they use for the farm handouts.
Or the rental market…
Because healthcare would help you
Uhhh, so much for the free market Republicans spent decades championing
They’ll run it into the ground regardless.
Well, yeah, they always do. Republican admins always leave the economy in the shitter and saddle the nation up with debt so that the incoming Democratic admin has to spend all of their time bringing the economy back up to speed rather than implementing effective reform.
They aren’t interested in effective reform either. Biden had chances to tax billionaires, or to imprison Trump. But yes they are better at handling the economy.
The “smartest people in the country” cant do two things at once?
And then Fox runs nonstop debt fear mongering and blaming democrats for the fiscal irresponsibly of the republicans
The market would be freer if it wasn’t dominated by a couple capitalist megacorpos. So nationalisation doesn’t mean less freedom, although neolib propaganda would love you to think so.
beat me to it
Wow. Throw 16M people off health care, then invest the ‘savings’ in corporations. HEy, Intel, how do you like your blood money?
Historical evidence would seem to suggest that Intel very much do like their blood money I would imagine they would like some more please.
Heck, as long as they keep being good competition for AMD so they don’t become complacent, they can get the souls of the damned as payment for all I care.
I don’t think the souls of the damned are up for grabs, since, you know, they’re damned and all.
They are worth more
government owning the means of production?
🤔
Not socialism.
There’s a different word for that, unless you think the American government represents the working class.
deleted by creator
I feel like that should’ve already been a given when the 13th and 14th gen Core processors permanently kneecap themselves if they feel like it. But that’s just me.
Me too.
Fascism is a far-right, ultranationalist, and authoritarian political ideology that emerged in early 20th-century Europe, characterized by a totalitarian, one-party state, a charismatic leader, a fixation on national decline, and the suppression of individual rights and opposition groups. It combines elements of militarism, economic self-sufficiency, and mass mobilization, often through propaganda and violence, to achieve a vision of national purity and power.
Yes but contrary to China, USA doesn’t use government subsidies to promote their own industries, or state owned companies to spy on the rest of the world. 🤪
/SI hope Intel survives because a Chinese (mainland+Taiwan) monopoly will not be good, but I am so sick of American disinformation regarding China. Always blaming China for things USA has been guilty of for decades before China.
Are you sure about that? US hardware is spying on the rest of the world for decades. Cisco is in no way better then huawei.
Can you not see the crazy smiley? Clearly indicating the statement is crazy. It was sarcasm, but OK I’ll add the /S.
Also the part that USA did it for decades before China should clearly indicate the part above was sarcasm???
Reading comprehension is a skill. It seems like some people just glance at the words and make up what they expect to see. I have no idea how your comment could have been interpreted the way they did without a total disregard for the substance. Maybe they were reading it through an auto translation? Still, seems like the emoji is pretty obvious.
I hope Intel survives
Are you sure about that? US hardware is spying on the rest of the world for decades. Cisco is in no way better then huawei.
That might be how you are supposed to read that response
OK that could have been stated more clearly, but why should I be against Intel, because USA has used Cisco for spying?
That’s exactly the kind of stupid accusations without evidence I’m tired of USA making against China. Obviously the same standard goes the other way too.
And if Intel goes away, USA can still do it through AMD. 😋
Well, now that they’re doing it like China is, the rest of the world should use tariffs to mitigate this, like we do with Chinese EVs for an example (since those are so heavily subsidized to root out competition not just in China, but worldwide)
So uh, Intel doesn’t get anything, and gives up 10% of their stock because they’ve just decided to retroactively alter the CHIPs act?
No, not at all. The government bought shares in Intel. When you have shares in a company you own part of the company.
Just to clarify and add to what you said, equity shares are not stocks. The gov gets dividends and such, but it isn’t stock that is bought and sold on wall street. It’s all about profitability and not about speculation. If the company makes money, so does the gov. If it loses money, the gov loses money.
deleted by creator
AyyyyyyyyMD
If tax payers are going to be investing into these businesses and they’re avoiding taxes taking a share of the company is better than nothing.
I mean, it’s socialism, but don’t tell their voters
🤫
Release the Trump/Epstein files
Everyone calling this socialism is a moron
Care to elaborate?
Socialism is workers owning the means of production. Not the government. The government can be fucking anything and it (or the people controlling it) profiting from owning a company isn’t socialism by itself.
It’s fine and all to talk about a worker’s government but is that what you would call a Trump presidency? The American government at any point in its history? Will literally ONE FUCKING DOLLAR of Intel profit go to a worker from this?
They’re cutting social services and expanding the power of the surveillance state. Just think for one goddamn second about function instead of form, I’m begging you people.
Could call it national socialism.
Boycot Intel? Okay, you got it!
Already buying AMD. Nothing personal, AMD CPUs are just better, faster, more efficient and easier to upgrade.
