And it seems that her posts and comments were deleted along with her account :(
So in Lemmy all your contributions will be removed if you delete your account? I think it harms the platform. why not follow a similar model to reddit?
For privacy reasons. Actually, a lot of privacy conscious people hate how Reddit handles it, because it’s actually extremely difficult to delete all of your data even if you tried (the only display I think 1000 of the most recent items, and any content pushed off that queue is hidden from your user page permanently, even if later content is deleted, so you have to use the search box and search engines to find them, but even then it’s not guaranteed you’ll get everything). You also have to make your choice whether to go through the content deletion process (which typically involves running a third party script while logged into your account) before deleting your account, because that action is irreversible and there is pretty much no way to retroactively delete your data afterward.
IMO, with Lemmy (and Reddit), because you’re pretty much expected to not put in any personal information, if you don’t want to use the account anymore but still want your content on here, you can just not use the account, with the option of permanently deleting everything later.
before deleting your account, because that action is irreversible and there is pretty much no way to retroactively delete your data afterward.
You can give users a time period to change their mind, after which their prefered option will apply to their content, deleting all of it, or keeping the content anonymously.
Except something might come up that causes you to want to permanently delete your stuff years down the line. For example, if you’re getting stalked or doxxed because the content you thought were anonymous still contained enough information to piece together stuff about you. It happens and is a problem.
I’m honestly against user content with no way for the user to delete it in general.
I think it’s fairly easy to see if the information in a few comments were enabling stalking or doxing. But again consider that such a happening would be extremely rare and might never happen.
I understand that users might want to remove any trace of their activities, but I think comments and posts being disassociated from their identity (similar to reddit, at least on the surface level) would give almost the same benefits to the user, while not deleting all of their contributions.
But my main problem with the current system is that all the posts get removed as well, and in this case her posts were popular and had a lot of comments, so it’s not like we’re giving users the ability to delete their own content, but also the comments written by others, which I think is unfair. I mean people took their time and gave their opinions on which phone and OS is more privacy friendly and other subjects (like a collabrative documentary about the fediverse), it’s not a good thing to delete their comments like this.
that being said I think the main loss here is that we lost one of the most active users :(
I think when you are engaging in a conversation on a public forum it’s more important to keep the conversation readable in the future. I’m not sure I consider comments I post to be “my” data once I’ve shared it with everyone else. I remain the author, but I kiss control of them goodbye once they’re published for others to see.
Yes, but the same time if someone intentionally removes an account (as opposed to just abandoning it) then there is a clear intent to want to delete the data and I think out of respect it is the right thing to remove them. Obviously there are many ways those posts live on in backups and archives, so this is really only a thing done out of respect for the decision of the user.
However I guess when deleting the account there could be a question to the user if they want their old posts to be preserved or not.
However I guess when deleting the account there could be a question to the user if they want their old posts to be preserved or not.
Good point, could you make an issue for that? You can try the account deletion yourself, there is a confirmation dialog so you cant do it by accident. We should also clarify the warning message, to specify which data gets deleted.
Edit: Maybe we should also wait a month or so before deleting the email address, so that the account can still be restored if you change your mind.
Cool down of deleted accounts might also be better for federation, at least I somehow remember that being the reason why accounts in Hubzilla only get fully removed after 4 weeks.
I dont think there is any problem with federation in that regard. But its worth noting that user federation is not federated yet on Lemmy, so you can still view that user profile and their posts/comments on other instances.
would you also consider giving users the third option of disassociating comments and posts from their identity? I imagine some people might want their contributions to the community to remain available (for example on support and question subs) in an anonymous manner.
And what is your opinion on users being able to delete the comments of other users by deleting the post? Don’t you think it’s unfair to those who have taken the time to answer a question or participate in a discussion?
would you also consider giving users the third option of disassociating comments and posts from their identity? I imagine some people might want their contributions to the community to remain available (for example on support and question subs) in an anonymous manner.
Except what if you want to delete the data later? You wouldn’t be able to if it’s truly anonymized because you wouldn’t be able to prove it was you. I can support an option to hide the name of your content from your account, kind of a “soft delete”, but IMO in general, if an account is permanently deleted, all the data should go to for privacy sake.
good point, I think giving users some time to change their mind and then making the decision permanent would be a good solution.
I can support an option to hide the name of your content from your account, kind of a “soft delete”
Agree. a soft delete would be cool, with an option of deleting it later.
but IMO in general, if an account is permanently deleted, all the data should go to for privacy sake.
I think giving users three options to choose from is better, so that everyone can make their own informed decisions, according to their threat model. Some information (like the answer to a technical problem) doesn’t harm privacy that much, and keeping it anonymously is a net positive in my opinion.
But as I said, my main problem is the ability to delete the comments of others by deleting the post. I don’t think a user should have the right to remove comments written by others.
And it seems that her posts and comments were deleted along with her account :(
So in Lemmy all your contributions will be removed if you delete your account? I think it harms the platform. why not follow a similar model to reddit?
For privacy reasons. Actually, a lot of privacy conscious people hate how Reddit handles it, because it’s actually extremely difficult to delete all of your data even if you tried (the only display I think 1000 of the most recent items, and any content pushed off that queue is hidden from your user page permanently, even if later content is deleted, so you have to use the search box and search engines to find them, but even then it’s not guaranteed you’ll get everything). You also have to make your choice whether to go through the content deletion process (which typically involves running a third party script while logged into your account) before deleting your account, because that action is irreversible and there is pretty much no way to retroactively delete your data afterward.
IMO, with Lemmy (and Reddit), because you’re pretty much expected to not put in any personal information, if you don’t want to use the account anymore but still want your content on here, you can just not use the account, with the option of permanently deleting everything later.
You can give users a time period to change their mind, after which their prefered option will apply to their content, deleting all of it, or keeping the content anonymously.
Except something might come up that causes you to want to permanently delete your stuff years down the line. For example, if you’re getting stalked or doxxed because the content you thought were anonymous still contained enough information to piece together stuff about you. It happens and is a problem.
I’m honestly against user content with no way for the user to delete it in general.
In case of getting doxxed or stalked, user can contact the admin or moderators and ask for the removal of personally identifiable information.
it’s hard to verify the person’s identity in that case
I think it’s fairly easy to see if the information in a few comments were enabling stalking or doxing. But again consider that such a happening would be extremely rare and might never happen.
Removed by mod
It might harm the platform, but is better for the user.
I understand that users might want to remove any trace of their activities, but I think comments and posts being disassociated from their identity (similar to reddit, at least on the surface level) would give almost the same benefits to the user, while not deleting all of their contributions.
But my main problem with the current system is that all the posts get removed as well, and in this case her posts were popular and had a lot of comments, so it’s not like we’re giving users the ability to delete their own content, but also the comments written by others, which I think is unfair. I mean people took their time and gave their opinions on which phone and OS is more privacy friendly and other subjects (like a collabrative documentary about the fediverse), it’s not a good thing to delete their comments like this.
that being said I think the main loss here is that we lost one of the most active users :(
deleted by creator
I think when you are engaging in a conversation on a public forum it’s more important to keep the conversation readable in the future. I’m not sure I consider comments I post to be “my” data once I’ve shared it with everyone else. I remain the author, but I kiss control of them goodbye once they’re published for others to see.
Yes, but the same time if someone intentionally removes an account (as opposed to just abandoning it) then there is a clear intent to want to delete the data and I think out of respect it is the right thing to remove them. Obviously there are many ways those posts live on in backups and archives, so this is really only a thing done out of respect for the decision of the user.
However I guess when deleting the account there could be a question to the user if they want their old posts to be preserved or not.
Good point, could you make an issue for that? You can try the account deletion yourself, there is a confirmation dialog so you cant do it by accident. We should also clarify the warning message, to specify which data gets deleted.
Edit: Maybe we should also wait a month or so before deleting the email address, so that the account can still be restored if you change your mind.
Ok done: https://github.com/LemmyNet/lemmy-ui/issues/299
Cool down of deleted accounts might also be better for federation, at least I somehow remember that being the reason why accounts in Hubzilla only get fully removed after 4 weeks.
I dont think there is any problem with federation in that regard. But its worth noting that user federation is not federated yet on Lemmy, so you can still view that user profile and their posts/comments on other instances.
https://github.com/LemmyNet/lemmy/issues/1284
Removed by mod
would you also consider giving users the third option of disassociating comments and posts from their identity? I imagine some people might want their contributions to the community to remain available (for example on support and question subs) in an anonymous manner.
And what is your opinion on users being able to delete the comments of other users by deleting the post? Don’t you think it’s unfair to those who have taken the time to answer a question or participate in a discussion?
Good point, I added that to the issue which povoq opened.
Thanks!
Except what if you want to delete the data later? You wouldn’t be able to if it’s truly anonymized because you wouldn’t be able to prove it was you. I can support an option to hide the name of your content from your account, kind of a “soft delete”, but IMO in general, if an account is permanently deleted, all the data should go to for privacy sake.
good point, I think giving users some time to change their mind and then making the decision permanent would be a good solution.
Agree. a soft delete would be cool, with an option of deleting it later.
I think giving users three options to choose from is better, so that everyone can make their own informed decisions, according to their threat model. Some information (like the answer to a technical problem) doesn’t harm privacy that much, and keeping it anonymously is a net positive in my opinion.
But as I said, my main problem is the ability to delete the comments of others by deleting the post. I don’t think a user should have the right to remove comments written by others.