• lloram239@feddit.de
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    1 year ago

    Just lovely how everybody is forgetting that Hamas is responsible for this all. They can end it any time they want, release the hostages and surrender, but they chose not to.

      • SCB@lemmy.world
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        1 year ago

        Prior to early October, Israel was completely out of Gaza, and was not attacking Gaza whatsoever, so no they weren’t killing them long before they took hostages.

        Also the entire siege is about trying to force Hamas to give up hostages. That is literally the reason it is being done. Hamas also has massive food, water, and fuel stockpiles they refuse to share with the people they “govern”

        https://www.timesofisrael.com/idf-says-gaza-photos-show-half-million-liters-of-fuel-held-by-hamas/

        Also they’re using that fuel to power the ventilation systems in their tunnels that run on generators

        https://m.jpost.com/israel-news/article-770123

        • a_random_large_banana@lemmings.world
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          1 year ago

          I urge you to get your source not from literally the entity being excused of genocide (or its direct allies e.i. US news outlets). they have enough money to throw so much propaganda at you that you would never believe anything else.

          from one online stranger to another: using and citing sources as such is an instant discredit.

    • Cethin@lemmy.zip
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      1 year ago

      Just lovely how everybody is forgetting that Israel is responsible for that.

      Everyone can always blame someone else, especially in this conflict. It’s time for Israel to grow up and take responsibility for its actions. They have caused harm, anger, and hatred by using terrorism (fear and violence) to enforce their rule over people. Somehow we (the US and most of the west) provide them with resources and weapons though. How fucked up is that?

      • lloram239@feddit.de
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        1 year ago

        Hamas has launched in the realm of 7000 rockets at Israel civilians since October 7. But hey, keep blaming it all on Israel. Lets make antisemitism cool again, you are doing your part already.

        And as always: Propose an alternative to how Israel should defend itself instead. Still haven’t heard anybody give one and it has been weeks.

        • Serdan@lemm.ee
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          1 year ago

          Commiting genocide against a civilian population is not self defense. How can you read an article like the OP and just be completely empty inside? How broken are you?

          • lloram239@feddit.de
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            1 year ago

            Commiting genocide against a civilian population is not self defense.

            For one, they don’t.

            And as always: Propose an alternative to how Israel should defend itself instead. Still haven’t heard anybody give one and it has been weeks.

            But keep listening to that Hamas propaganda it’s totally not rotting your brain away.

            • Cethin@lemmy.zip
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              1 year ago

              An alternative? There are infinite. They can start cooperating and make a good will gesture of returning occupied lands back to the Palestinian people. They can stop colonizing and murdering innocent civilians (which isn’t only just now happening, it’s constant in occupied lands). They can loosen restriction on travel between Gaza and Israel.

              The solution is to improve relations with the people. Attacking them and killing civilians only causes more hate, which causes more violence. It isn’t defence. It’s genocide. They get Hamas to attack and they get to kill more Palestinians.

              • lloram239@feddit.de
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                1 year ago

                They tried that, didn’t work, each time they were meet with more Hamas terrorism. What’s your second suggestion from the pool of infinite alternative?

                • Cethin@lemmy.zip
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                  1 year ago

                  They never tried that. They have been constantly expanding colonies and murdering civilians in occupied lands. The whole nation started with just some Jews colonizing the territory, and it was made official after that when they knew there was no stopping it (not that they would anyway). They did reduce their harm for a period, but they never really tried to do good.

                  • mwguy@infosec.pub
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                    1 year ago

                    They never tried that.

                    They did, in the Gaza Strip which has no colonies, self rule and the 1967 borders. In the mid 2000s. They evicted every Jew from the Gaza strip

                  • lloram239@feddit.de
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                    1 year ago

                    What’s your second suggestion from the pool of infinite alternative? Or are you already out of ideas?

          • fosforus
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            1 year ago

            Commiting genocide against a civilian population is not self defense.

            Only Hamas is doing that, though.

            • PizzaMan@lemmy.world
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              1 year ago

              Isreal is indiscriminately bombing civilian population centers and diving out people based on ethnicity.

              What Isreal is doing absolutely falls under the category of genocide.

              Kill civilians is indefensible.

              • mwguy@infosec.pub
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                1 year ago

                Isreal is indiscriminately bombing civilian/Palestinian population centers and diving people out of their homes.*

                A 48 hour WW2 era artillery barrages would flatten the Gaza Strip. Believing that Israel is “indiscriminately bombing” the strip requires you to believe that they’re the most incompetent military force to have ever walked the planet.

                • PizzaMan@lemmy.world
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                  1 year ago

                  When I say “indiscriminate” I mean “disregard for civilian casualties” not “random bombings”.

                  • mwguy@infosec.pub
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                    1 year ago

                    They clearly have a regard for civilian casualties. That’s why they haven’t hit some mosques, schools and other buildings that are known to be seats of Hamas’ power.

              • SCB@lemmy.world
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                1 year ago

                Isreal is indiscriminately bombing civilian population centers and diving out people based on ethnicity.

                These two things are mutually exclusive

                • Serdan@lemm.ee
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                  1 year ago

                  You’re "um ackshually"ing genocide. Reconsider your life.

                • PizzaMan@lemmy.world
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                  1 year ago

                  They’ve been bombing civilian centers that they know are predominantly of Palestinian ethnicity.

                  They’ve been evicting people from their homes based on ethnicity. The law gives Isrealis preferences in land disputes.

                  And now they’re telling everyone in Gaza to abandon their homes.

                  These are three different actions.

            • Sparlock@lemmy.world
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              1 year ago

              Would you prefer we call what Israel is doing ethnic cleansing instead?

              • fosforus
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                1 year ago

                That’s probably what they would like to do in their fantasies – make Gazans gtfo from that general area – but given their inefficiency of doing it, I don’t really know what’s going on. You don’t “ethnically cleanse” a rapidly growing population of 2 million by killing a few thousand here and there.

                Their birth rate is about 24/1000, so about 50000 new children are born there every year.

        • Cethin@lemmy.zip
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          1 year ago

          Why did you start counting at October 7th? Palestine, Hamas, and Israel have existed much longer and been in conflict much longer.

          Last I saw, which was before this conflict, Israel has killed 27 (I think, maybe 23 or something around there) Palestinians for every Israeli killed.

      • lloram239@feddit.de
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        1 year ago

        “Stop defending yourself while I murder you”

        Propose an alternative solution if you don’t like what IDF is doing, since otherwise all you are doing is nothing more than revoking their right for self defense.

    • Sparlock@lemmy.world
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      1 year ago

      Israel doesn’t give two shits about the hostages. If they did they wouldn’t keep bombing where they are being held.

      • SCB@lemmy.world
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        1 year ago

        Because Hamas’s stated purpose is to destroy Israel, and they knew their attack would be met with reprisal, so they took hostages as human meat-shields