Its only the same if you strictly consider ‘the time I stand in this line’.
Its different because everyone behind her loses a feeling of progress from moving up, and it increases the queue length (at least visually) which can impact other people’s decision on which queue to join which, of course can impact the other queues.
To think the way the image suggests is to be inconsiderate to others around you.
Right, that’s why it says perfectly rationally. If someone is really being perfectly rational they should only care about how long they wait inine, not a feeling of how long they wait. I don’t think being “perfectly rational” is something folks should strive to do.
Fuck everyone else though right? That doesn’t sound rational does it? In that case why even wait in the line? Just walk to the front because that will shorten your time
Right, it’s illustrating the foolishness of endlessly pursuing “rationality”, it’s not something people should do. I literally said it’s not a good thing. Just because something is rational doesn’t make it good. Humans are emotional beings.
Except being rational is not void of emotional reasoning, so “perfectly rational” does not mean “thinking without any emotional logic involved whatsoever”. This person isn’t thinking rationally, they’re just thinking very literally.
I think rational in this context doesn’t include emotional logic. I see your point though. I’m just saying I think they’re using the word differently than you.
I don’t think the person’s behaviour is rational at all. The queues in an airport are set up like they are for a good reason, to maximize the amount of people queuing in a given area. That is the rational behind the setup.
The person in the picture is ruining the system based in the time being spent queueing. But she is not considering the space taken up by the queue as a whole. Not very rational.
It’s not even the same if you strictly consider ‘the time I spend in this line’, which I would assume is to most people the time that actually matters.
Everyone behind her doesn’t just lose the feeling of progress, they lose actual time (granted it’s probably just a few seconds). And she loses that time also.
The actual justification here seems to be that she’s busy doing something on her phone and doesn’t want to be distracted every 30 seconds, which in her mind trumps the handful of seconds she and everyone behind her would gain.
Which imo would be fair enough, if you didn’t have to also add the annoyance of the people behind her to the equation.
Many people standing in such queues are tired, stressed about catching their flight, or otherwise impaired and someone holding up the queue for no obvious reason can become aggravating fast.
But it’s just a feeling of progress not actual progress. Whether she moves or not there’s still the same amount of people ahead of you in queue.
Plus it’s an airport you queue for the airline that you booked with there’s no decision of queue to impact. The only actual factor is whether or not it spills out past the barriers so she can periodically check and move if that’s the case
The feeling of progress literally affects how our brains perceive time. We experience it passing more quickly when we are moving and feel like we are progressing. To our brains and our perception of time, it very much is the same as actual progress.
True rationality and logic would not dismiss perception. Time is literally relative. How the brain perceives the passage of time and the factors that affect it is a fact of biology. If you perceive time as passing more slowly when you aren’t moving, then being forced to stand still will literally make it take longer for you from your frame of reference.
Unless they considered all of those things and only didn’t move because there wasn’t any point, which to me is ultimately what staying in place is about.
In that very specific situation, yes it’s inconsiderate. We’re missing details like how busy the airport is etc so it’s a little unfair to point out though.
Its only the same if you strictly consider ‘the time I stand in this line’.
Its different because everyone behind her loses a feeling of progress from moving up, and it increases the queue length (at least visually) which can impact other people’s decision on which queue to join which, of course can impact the other queues.
To think the way the image suggests is to be inconsiderate to others around you.
Right, that’s why it says perfectly rationally. If someone is really being perfectly rational they should only care about how long they wait inine, not a feeling of how long they wait. I don’t think being “perfectly rational” is something folks should strive to do.
Fuck everyone else though right? That doesn’t sound rational does it? In that case why even wait in the line? Just walk to the front because that will shorten your time
Right, it’s illustrating the foolishness of endlessly pursuing “rationality”, it’s not something people should do. I literally said it’s not a good thing. Just because something is rational doesn’t make it good. Humans are emotional beings.
Nice strawman bro
Except being rational is not void of emotional reasoning, so “perfectly rational” does not mean “thinking without any emotional logic involved whatsoever”. This person isn’t thinking rationally, they’re just thinking very literally.
I think rational in this context doesn’t include emotional logic. I see your point though. I’m just saying I think they’re using the word differently than you.
If it doesn’t include emotional logic when humans are fundamentally emotional beings, then it’s not rational.
Which is why I think it’s clear they’re using the term rational differently and not including emotional logic.
I don’t think the person’s behaviour is rational at all. The queues in an airport are set up like they are for a good reason, to maximize the amount of people queuing in a given area. That is the rational behind the setup.
The person in the picture is ruining the system based in the time being spent queueing. But she is not considering the space taken up by the queue as a whole. Not very rational.
Being impolite isn’t the same as being irrational.
Not only is it the same amount of wait time, but you have to pick up and put down your suitcase less times.
If you can’t lift your bags, pack less.
It’s not even the same if you strictly consider ‘the time I spend in this line’, which I would assume is to most people the time that actually matters.
Everyone behind her doesn’t just lose the feeling of progress, they lose actual time (granted it’s probably just a few seconds). And she loses that time also.
The actual justification here seems to be that she’s busy doing something on her phone and doesn’t want to be distracted every 30 seconds, which in her mind trumps the handful of seconds she and everyone behind her would gain.
Which imo would be fair enough, if you didn’t have to also add the annoyance of the people behind her to the equation.
Many people standing in such queues are tired, stressed about catching their flight, or otherwise impaired and someone holding up the queue for no obvious reason can become aggravating fast.
But it’s just a feeling of progress not actual progress. Whether she moves or not there’s still the same amount of people ahead of you in queue. Plus it’s an airport you queue for the airline that you booked with there’s no decision of queue to impact. The only actual factor is whether or not it spills out past the barriers so she can periodically check and move if that’s the case
The feeling of progress literally affects how our brains perceive time. We experience it passing more quickly when we are moving and feel like we are progressing. To our brains and our perception of time, it very much is the same as actual progress.
Yes and the whole point of the post is about pursuing perfect rationality which means only caring about facts and logic not perception.
True rationality and logic would not dismiss perception. Time is literally relative. How the brain perceives the passage of time and the factors that affect it is a fact of biology. If you perceive time as passing more slowly when you aren’t moving, then being forced to stand still will literally make it take longer for you from your frame of reference.
Absolutely… the subjective experience is an objective fact.
Unless they considered all of those things and only didn’t move because there wasn’t any point, which to me is ultimately what staying in place is about.
In that very specific situation, yes it’s inconsiderate. We’re missing details like how busy the airport is etc so it’s a little unfair to point out though.
I’d argue it’s always inconsiderate if there is even one person behind her