The real crime is marketing the driver assist capability under the name autopilot when it is anything but that.
I think the real crime is vehicular manslaughter, especially the SECOND one.
Do we need to go through what autopilot in a plane or boat actually does again?
It doesn’t matter, Tesla cars are marketed to the public which isn’t expected to know these things. To probably 90% of people “autopilot” means “drive automatically”.
To probably 90% of people “autopilot” means “drive automatically”.
Based on what?
Based on my usage and understanding of the word being a lay person.
I’m an engineer myself, sometimes there are words that you have to be cognizant of the differences in meaning to other engineers vs lay people or even engineers in other fields. Some words are heavily overloaded, and “autopilot” is kinda one of them (others being “domain”, “node”, “artificial intelligence”, etc.).
Tesla markets this feature as “Full Self-Driving Capability.” Maybe I’m poorly informed, but to me that means that the car is fully capable of driving itself without human interaction.
FSD is an entirely separate thing. Autopilot is just an LKAS system, or adaptive cruise control.
Aha, today I learned that Autopilot is just lane-keeping and adaptive cruise control. I feel that it must be a common misunderstanding to confuse the terms “Autopilot” and “Fully Self-Driving” in the vernacular.
Many other manufacturers refer to lane-keeping systems as “driver assistance,” and I believe Tesla is intentionally misleading consumers with the impression that their system is more capable and allows the driver to pay less attention.
Until you drive it. You know the capabilities, you know when you can and cannot activate it, you know how often it tells you to look at the road and if you don’t prove you’ve got your hands on the wheel, it disables itself for the drive (you need to park to reactivate it). No Tesla driver thinks autopilot is more than a lane and distance keeping assistance.
Autopilot is a marketing name, that’s it.
If we do, then they shouldn’t have picked a name that most people think does something it doesn’t.
When you drive a Tesla, it’s pretty clear what autopilot is. The name is a marketing term, you can’t engage it everywhere and anytime, you’ve got to keep your hands on the wheel or it disables itself, won’t stop at stop signs and red lights, won’t do line changes, etc.
do we need to go through the differences in training, aptitude and intelligence between pilots, captains and your neighbor Greg again? Marketing it as “autopilot” to anyone who can sign a car loan is reckless and has killed people and will continue to kill people until they stop
Yep, just like “cruise control” made tons of people drive their car into the ocean thinking they could sail it to popular island destinations.
What does full self driving mean ?
Full Self Driving and Autopilot are two totally separate systems.
Depends entirely on the type of autopilot.
Tesla should be playing wrongful death suits every time autopilot kills someone. Their excuses don’t excuse the blatant marketing that leads people to believe it’s a self driving car.
It’s a common misunderstanding that an autopilot system in an airplane does everything or even a lot of things. The most basic ones keep the wings level and nothing else. Of course Tesla is probably counting on that misconception to sell this feature, but actual pilots using any kind of autopilot are still on the hook to pay attention 100% of the time.
In an airplane that is fine as pilots are specifically trained on the planes they fly (at least in theory). No one gets a special course in how to drive a specific (non industrial) car…
Way to ignore the death of two people, and hijack the discussion for your own opinions. Good job /s
2 murders, 23 grand. The mafia charge more.
If you wanna kill somebody, use a car.
The $11,500 “murder” add-on
Involuntary manslaughter ≠ murder
The guy was going through a suburb at 75 mph blowing through stop lights. Ofcourse he has to pay, im surprised hes not getting jail time. This has nothing to do with the car, thats just gross negligence
My tesla doesn’t let me use autopilot or FSD if I set it over 5% of the posted speed limit. How is this guy going 75 in the burbs?
I wonder if Tesla had this section of road mapped as freeway. Especially since it rolled through a red.
“Suburb” in LA is a very loose term
I would think that the guy is just lying, but Tesla would call that out REAL quick.
That is unfortunately a configurable option.
My interpretation of the title is “only has to pay…”. 23K is nothing.
For fuck’s sake I doubt if that would cover funeral expenses.
It won’t even fix their car.
Wow the value of a life I guess. I don’t really know what can come close to the value of a life, but this doesn’t seem like it.
What would be the value of life then? I’ll save you the answer: no matter how big the number you say, someone else will say bigger. Until it becomes priceless, which is the answer.
However death and accidental death isn’t always avoidable. And when we pin the fault on someone we cannot expect to say “priceless” is what they owe the victim’s family. So we assign an amount of money or time that hurts, and call it good.
Doesn’t mean life is worth that. And saying so doesn’t help anyone.
The U.S. uses the value of statistical life VSL. Here are the numbers from the Department of Transportation over the last 10 years or so.
So, it is interesting and egregious that the driver needs only pay $23K and Tesla pays nothing at all!
So according to this, the DoT values a life at $12.5M in 2022? I’m curious about their methodology.
You look at different jobs, how high the risk of dying is and how much they pay, and work out from that how much more pay people demand for say a 1% risk increase. Then you scale that up to 100% risk.
So if you were to work an average job no one has ever survived, and you died on the day you retire, you would’ve earned those 12mil
Huh that’s kinda neat. Thanks!
That is just the fine, the families are suing the driver and Tesla. Here’s hoping the Tesla suit gives them the real prize: the death of a company.
(I know it won’t happen but a guy can dream.)
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That was the penalty for the felony charge for the driver of the car that ran off the highway into a surface street. It’s almost certain that drivers insurance also paid out their maximum.
In addition, Tesla is recalling all those cars to change the system that pretends to ensure a driver using autopilot is actually paying attention.
And a civil suit will likely follow from the 2 victims families.
There’s this saying about how if something is punishable by a fine, then it’s only illegal for poor people.
I don’t even have to finish this do I
Finland’s fine system at least tries: some fines scale based on the perp’s monthly income.
Example: https://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/jun/06/finnish-businessman-hit-with-121000-speeding-fine
I’m unshamedly proud of this. Apparently Switzerland has the same system.
I love this
There’s a joke that if you want to murder someone in America, make sure you do it in a car. Our courts are specifically tailored to avoid penalizing drivers for “accidentally” killing people.
Civil suit. He’s already been proven guilty
Fines = legal for a price.
Fines only exist to punish the poor.
You honor, I actually didn’t wack anyone with this self actuating axe. I bought it and I told it to go chop wood. The people just happened to be too close to the axe. Yeah I was holding the axe but I wasn’t actually putting any pressure. The tail was wagging the dog in other words.
Ok so $10,000.00. Fine? Oh alright I guess that’ll teach me not to buy autonomous axes.
Same as it ever was Kill a Pedestrian, Pay a $500 Fine
Come join the war on cars. !fuckcars@lemmy.world
the problem here is the law. there should be actual consequences, not fines. jail time for murder.
Part of the reason why you don’t lose your license for killing someone with a car in the US is because it’s much more of a ‘punishment’ because of how car dependent the US is.
Also, keep in mind a lot of trips are 3 miles or less in the US, and most drive it, despite wanting alternatives to driving.
If someone is trying to get from A to B in a 2 mile trip and the government basically mandates people to drive that, can you really blame them if they end up killing someone accidentally? What if they accidentally kill themselves smashing into a tree? You might assign some of the blame to their driving, but would that solve anything in the long term? a large part of the blame should be assigned to this insane transportation system we’ve built where everyone needs to drive 2 miles to pick up a bag of milk.
TLDR prevention, not blame will reduce traffic violence.
I think many don’t use the alternatives because there are significant challenges vs using a car you’re already paying for.
I’d love to bicycle but it’s just not safe.
You’re already paying for a car because your infrastructure demands one. I’m not in the US and get by just fine without one. Saves me a shitload of money too.
Cycling is unsafe because your infrastructure was built exclusively for cars. Your infrastructure is built exclusively for cars because most people have to use cars because your infrastructure was built exclusively for cars. It’s circular reasoning.
Both of those issues are caused by infrastructure and would be solved by building slightly less stupid infrastructure.
Which is a good reason for people that want bicycle infra to vote and run for office!
Also theres the edge cases like mine where walking and biking are vastly slower than driving even though the city is somewhat walkable, because I live at one of the highest elevated roads in my city. Its a 15 min walk or a 5 min bike to places, its a 1 hr walk back and a 30 min bike back.
proper education for drivers and decent bike lanes are key. absolutely agree.
Well, he didn´t do anything … /s
So $11.500 per Person. Huh. I would have guessed it that american Lives would be more expensive.
American taxpayers will pick up the rest of the bill. Nice subsidy for the rich.
uh is that it?
Wait, I’m confused, I thought this was Tesla’s fault?
