From the tread on reddit:

Bizarre allegations by Reddit of Apollo “blackmailing” and “threatening” Reddit

About 24 hours after that call with Reddit, I received this odd message on Mastodon:

“Can you please comment publicly about the internal Reddit claim that you tried to “blackmail” them for a $10,000,000 payout to “stay quiet”?”

Then yesterday, moderators told me they were on a call with CEO Steve Huffman (spez), and he said the following per their transcript:

Steve: “Apollo threatened us, said they’ll “make it easy” if Reddit gave them $10 million.”

Steve: “This guy behind the scenes is coercing us. He’s threatening us.”

Wow. Because my memory is that you didn’t take it as a threat, and you even apologized profusely when you admitted you misheard it. It’s very easy to take a single line and make it look bad by removing all the rest of the context, so let’s look at the full context.

I can only assume you didn’t realize I was recording the call, because there’s no way you’d be so blatantly lying if you did.

As said, a common suggestion across the many threads on this topic was “If third-party apps are costing Reddit so much money, why don’t they just buy them out like they did Alien Blue?” That was the point I brought up. If running Apollo as it stands now would cost you $20 million yearly as you quote, I suggested you cut a check to me to end Apollo. I said I’d even do it for half that or six months worth: $10 million, what a deal!

The bizarre thing is - initially - on the call you interpreted that as a threat. Even giving you the benefit of the doubt that maybe my phrasing was confusing, I asked for you to elaborate on how you found what I said to be a threat, because I was incredibly confused how you interpreted it that way. You responded that I said “Hey, if you want this to go away…” Which is not at all what I said, so I reiterated that I said “If you want to Apollo to go quiet, as in it’s quite loud in terms of API usage”.

What did you then say?

Me: “I said ‘If you want Apollo to go quiet’. Like in terms of- I would say it’s quite loud in terms of its API usage.”

Reddit: “Oh. Go quiet as in that. Okay, got it. Got it. Sorry.”

Reddit: “That’s a complete misinterpretation on my end. I apologize. I apologize immediately.”

The admission that you mistook me, and the four subsequent apologies led me to believe that you acknowledged you mistook me and you were apologetic. The fact that you’re pretending none of this happened (or was recorded), and instead espousing a different reality where instead of apologizing for taking it as a threat, you’re instead going the complete opposite direction and saying “He threatened us!” is so low I almost don’t believe it.

But again, I’ve recorded all my calls with you just in case you tried something like this.

Transcript of this part of the call: https://gist.github.com/christianselig/fda7e8bc5a25aec9824f915e6a5c7014

Audio of this part of the call: http://christianselig.com/apollo-end/reddit-third-call-may-31-end.m4a

(If you take issue with the call being recorded please remember that I’m in Canada and so long as one participant in the call (me) consents to being recorded, it’s legal. If anyone would like the recording of the full call, I’m happy to provide.)

I bring this up for two reasons:

  • I don’t want Reddit slandering me to internal employees or public people by saying I threatened them when they reality is that they immediately apologized for misunderstanding me.
  • It shows why I’ve finally come to the conclusion that I don’t think this situation is recoverable. If Reddit is willing to stoop to such deep lows as to slander individuals with blatant lies to try to get community favor back, I no longer have any faith they want this to work, or ever did.
  • relevants@feddit.de
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    42
    ·
    1 year ago

    This is what ultimately sealed the deal for me that I shouldn’t hold out any hope for a reasonable agreement after the blackout. Clearly reddit leadership is not interested in maintaining any sort of relationship with the 3PA developers, even if they were willing to pay. What unprofessional and frankly appalling behavior.

    • TeaHands@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      21
      ·
      1 year ago

      Unprofessional is absolutely the word. And now they look even worse than they already did, good thinking on his part to keep a record of all of this.

  • lemme@sh.itjust.works
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    38
    ·
    1 year ago

    I wasn’t expecting reddit overlords to be so childish. But this saga helped me find lemmy, so I have mixed feelings 😂

    • cnnrduncan@beehaw.org
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      5
      ·
      edit-2
      1 year ago

      Spez was caught editing comments that were insulting him like half a decade ago, this is entirely on brand for the reddit admin team.

  • Admetus
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    30
    arrow-down
    1
    ·
    1 year ago

    Spez was supposed to do an ama today but it doesn’t exist anymore. Did it bomb? 😂

  • Signfeld@lemm.ee
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    24
    arrow-down
    1
    ·
    1 year ago

    You know, the API situation in general made me want to leave Reddit, but I thought to myself, “whatever, I’ll browse on desktop sometimes.” This, though, is absolutely insane. I’m going to start packing my shit up and move on.

    It really is unbelievable. I seriously did not believe this post at first until I looked into it further.

  • Venus@slrpnk.net
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    22
    ·
    1 year ago

    Ooh, spicy. Reddit really does want to turn this into the biggest messiest drama they can, huh?

  • CarolineJohnson@kbin.social
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    22
    arrow-down
    2
    ·
    edit-2
    1 year ago

    Reddit being just as scummy as when they banned brigading and hate…

    (Context: many subs that publicly participated in and encouraged those banned things, such as an infamous anti-black sub as well as an infamous Trump-related sub, were left up, and it took over a month before the best known rule breaking subs were properly banned. There were mass petitions and everything and those subs were ignored for a long time. )

    • Ruorc@lemmy.ml
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      22
      ·
      1 year ago

      We knew the IPO was going to destroy reddit, but the fact they decided to expedite the process is impressive, in its own dumb way.

  • Sibbo
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    16
    ·
    1 year ago

    Why is this like a bunch of kindergardeners fighting over chocolate? Should they not talk to those affected by a new policy before they make it public, and negotiate about a solution that is not just destructive?

    • Muntjac@lemmy.ml
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      30
      ·
      1 year ago

      Whenever Reddit execs have made the news over the past decade or so, the clear impression I’ve had is that they are just a bunch of immature highschoolers who are in way over their depth.

      • Kichae@kbin.social
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        19
        ·
        1 year ago

        Remember the kinda dumb kid from high school with a rich family and a mean spirit?

        Congratulations, they’re all of our bosses now.

  • chovy@kbin.social
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    15
    ·
    1 year ago

    spez is the ceo now…he strikes again. reddit really managed to turn a good thing into absolute garbage over the past 8 years.

    • perkele
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      8
      ·
      1 year ago

      It’s been such a slow decline but the writing has been on the wall for a while. Maybe this is the push everyone needs to take a chance on a new platform.

  • RagingNerdoholic@lemmy.ml
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    10
    ·
    edit-2
    1 year ago

    After hearing the call audio — and I am not defending spez here — I can actually understand how it might have been initially perceived as a “threat” given the context of the conversation. It was a mix of technical and financial negotiations (or really just spez saying “this is how it is, you can suck it”) and Christian was speaking metaphorically about Apollo’s API calls being “noisy” and (at least how I understood it) was suggesting perhaps “quiet” it down by optimizing the software.

    I am not trying to victim blame here and it absolutely does not excuse spez turning around and publicly shit talking Christian, especially after spez immediately apologized on the call after admitting to misinterpreting what he heard … anyway, the point I’m trying to make is that it’s important to communicate clearly, directly, and unambiguously.

    The headline is still that spez is a greedy sack of shit.