I don’t know if the point of view of a foreigner is welcomed or relevant but hey, you know, American politics invites itself too much into European politics so I’ll give my opinion anyway.
we ran a shitty candidate again?
A week ago, Harris was hailed like the second coming of Christ and now she is the cause of the fall of USA into fascism. The dumb personification in US politics is super tiring.
He won. The DNC is to blame.
No, the half of your country that is fine with fascism is to blame. The issue is not with democrats or the DNC, it is the fact that Trump’s numbers are very stable despite all the bullshit he does and say. The DNC is the tool to motivate the other half of the electorate, but don’t lose sight of the half that is responsible for it.
What exactly are we protesting at this stage?
A protest has two functions: showing discontent to the rulers but also to meet, organize and network in order to resist. A protest is a social gathering where people who care enough about issues to come and spend a whole day on it can meet each other.
Or is it that we’re protesting only in the blue states or cities where it seems unfair to be governed by the will of the hillbilly underbelly.
To know the theme, you had to be there. The media NEVER represents a protest accurately.
If you really believe that Trump is going to install a fascist dictatorship, you are supposed to start organize the resistance.
I don’t think you fully grasp the dynamics, but from an outside perspective I’m sure it’s difficult to truly appreciate.
The DNC must be held responsible, because the establishment politicians completely control the narrative. And, except for the ridiculously stacked Covid election in 2020, they have lost 3 times in a row. If dem leadership is never held accountable for their mistakes leading to election losses, then they will never be able to right the ship and gain any real power or momentum. They are not owed our votes - they must effectively campaign to win them. That’s politics.
Unfortunately, as Nancy Pelosi is so fond of saying, Dems prefer to “lean to the green.” They chase corporate donations above all else, and garner voter apathy and disdain as a result. America has nobody (save Bernie Sanders) who fights for the working class now. Unfortunately, Trump at least has the political wherewithal to pretend to be a populist, and says things that trick people into voting for him. The Dems can’t even do that. Trump lost votes compared to last time because he’s a criminal fascist buffoon, to the tune of over 2 million votes. Harris lost many more, over 10 million compared to 2020, because she abandoned the working class and refused to even do so much as call Israelis genocidal. Hell, she was a straight up war hawk in her dem convention speech - dems are supposed to be the anti war party!
So yeah, it’s wrong to blame the voters, the fault lies squarely with Dem leadership if for anything else because they have all the power. Dem voters are sick of getting screwed for over 40 years now, and many repug voters simply want to burn it all down. This is the end result of total corporate capture of government and late stage capitalism, massive problems which far transcend individual voters who may or may not be faced with apathy over a brutal system which consistently fails them.
I don’t think you fully grasp the dynamics, but from an outside perspective I’m sure it’s difficult to truly appreciate.
Quite honestly, I often think that Americans are more confused about their own politics than the rest of the world.
I do believe the working class would be better off with Bernie Sanders than Harris, but also better off with Harris than Trump. That’s fairly obvious. So why do you believe that being more pro-working-class would help Harris win their vote?
The working class does not care about the working class. That’s the thing. The main error of the left is to not own medias like conservatives do to aggressively push their views.
And I wish at one point progressives will try to reconquer the conservative electorate instead of infighting.
The main error of the left is to not own medias like conservatives do to aggressively push their views.
You’re right in that Dems are terrible on messaging. They really suck at it. But, Dems are center right. To call them “left” is just a fallacy these days, just look at their policy proposals if you can get past the identity politics bs to find them. I don’t agree that corporate news media is the answer. Look at what happened with CNN for example…corporations can be bought and quickly transformed to suit the new owners.
The working class does not care about the working class.
This is the exact kind of elitist bile Dems spew which turns off voters. Of course the working class cares deeply about their social and economic well being. Unfortunately, nobody in power does. Why should they, after all? Nobody they interact with on a daily basis suffers the plight of the working class citizenry. Still, paid family leave, universal federal background checks, child tax credit, Medicare for all - these are all insanely popular policies which poll at 60-90%+ approval ratings. Why do the Dems refuse to run on these issues? Because their donors pay them not to.
It is not messaging. The messaging of conservatives is terrible too. It is about owning media to play the propaganda game. Policies are irrelevant, image is everything.
Of course the working class cares deeply about their social and economic well being.
They vote opposite to that. I know it sounds elitist, but it is also factual: someone poor who votes for Trump votes against their interests and does so out of ignorance.
Why do the Dems refuse to run on these issues?
They don’t?. See, they did not shout their message loud enough if you haven’t heard it. There is not a single “identity politics” item, that’s how conservatives have framed this and that’s their message you imprinted.
So fuck the platform, the same would have happened with Sanders. The problem is that the message is not being placarded loud enough into social media, TV, newspapers, that not enough people get bribed to tell voters they are stupid if they don’t vote for dems.
The gloves should have been taken off a while ago. The battlefield is the widely ignorant voter population. Either you find a way to educate them or you accept to play the propaganda game.
They are not owed our votes - they must effectively campaign to win them. That’s politics.
You aren’t owed life, or shelter, food every day, or freedom from imprisonment from no reason. Or from torture. Nobody outside yourself has any obligation to create for you a system that you like.
We made all this up, all this justice, flawed or not. We create it every day. Except now it might be about to go away. We either get together and create and sustain it, or it can blow away like a fart in the wind.
That’s realpolitik. Welcome to it, and congratulations.
No, the half of your country that is fine with fascism is too blame.
*Also to blame.
A week ago, Harris was hailed like the second coming of Christ and now the cause of the fall of USA into Fascism.
Not by all of us. I didn’t want her in 2020, either. She’s a glorified cop. Example: as a DA, how many people did she imprison for marijuana charges? But then she ran on legalization? I know there’s more to this and nuance is everything, but that hypocrisy is and example.
Applying the law but wanting it to change is what is called “rule of law” and democracy. Not understanding it is a part of what makes it so easy to slide into fascism.
“Nuance” my ass. Expecting a DA to follow its conviction instead of the law is the opposite of what you want.
That’s what I was getting at. Frankly, I wouldn’t want a DA or any cop-adjacent to run the country. Better her than the Orange Turd, but I’m splitting hairs here.
Anyone should have been a shoe-in against him. But they weren’t. She wasn’t. It wasn’t a single factor. We will scream until we’re blue in the face, pun intended, but in the end, the Dems fucked this.
The candidate they ran was not better than Trump at connecting with the populace. As a result, we got a false populist.
I don’t know if the point of view of a foreigner is welcomed or relevant but hey, you know, American politics invites itself too much into European politics so I’ll give my opinion anyway.
A week ago, Harris was hailed like the second coming of Christ and now she is the cause of the fall of USA into fascism. The dumb personification in US politics is super tiring.
No, the half of your country that is fine with fascism is to blame. The issue is not with democrats or the DNC, it is the fact that Trump’s numbers are very stable despite all the bullshit he does and say. The DNC is the tool to motivate the other half of the electorate, but don’t lose sight of the half that is responsible for it.
A protest has two functions: showing discontent to the rulers but also to meet, organize and network in order to resist. A protest is a social gathering where people who care enough about issues to come and spend a whole day on it can meet each other.
To know the theme, you had to be there. The media NEVER represents a protest accurately.
If you really believe that Trump is going to install a fascist dictatorship, you are supposed to start organize the resistance.
I don’t think you fully grasp the dynamics, but from an outside perspective I’m sure it’s difficult to truly appreciate.
The DNC must be held responsible, because the establishment politicians completely control the narrative. And, except for the ridiculously stacked Covid election in 2020, they have lost 3 times in a row. If dem leadership is never held accountable for their mistakes leading to election losses, then they will never be able to right the ship and gain any real power or momentum. They are not owed our votes - they must effectively campaign to win them. That’s politics.
Unfortunately, as Nancy Pelosi is so fond of saying, Dems prefer to “lean to the green.” They chase corporate donations above all else, and garner voter apathy and disdain as a result. America has nobody (save Bernie Sanders) who fights for the working class now. Unfortunately, Trump at least has the political wherewithal to pretend to be a populist, and says things that trick people into voting for him. The Dems can’t even do that. Trump lost votes compared to last time because he’s a criminal fascist buffoon, to the tune of over 2 million votes. Harris lost many more, over 10 million compared to 2020, because she abandoned the working class and refused to even do so much as call Israelis genocidal. Hell, she was a straight up war hawk in her dem convention speech - dems are supposed to be the anti war party!
So yeah, it’s wrong to blame the voters, the fault lies squarely with Dem leadership if for anything else because they have all the power. Dem voters are sick of getting screwed for over 40 years now, and many repug voters simply want to burn it all down. This is the end result of total corporate capture of government and late stage capitalism, massive problems which far transcend individual voters who may or may not be faced with apathy over a brutal system which consistently fails them.
Quite honestly, I often think that Americans are more confused about their own politics than the rest of the world.
I do believe the working class would be better off with Bernie Sanders than Harris, but also better off with Harris than Trump. That’s fairly obvious. So why do you believe that being more pro-working-class would help Harris win their vote?
The working class does not care about the working class. That’s the thing. The main error of the left is to not own medias like conservatives do to aggressively push their views.
And I wish at one point progressives will try to reconquer the conservative electorate instead of infighting.
You’re right in that Dems are terrible on messaging. They really suck at it. But, Dems are center right. To call them “left” is just a fallacy these days, just look at their policy proposals if you can get past the identity politics bs to find them. I don’t agree that corporate news media is the answer. Look at what happened with CNN for example…corporations can be bought and quickly transformed to suit the new owners.
This is the exact kind of elitist bile Dems spew which turns off voters. Of course the working class cares deeply about their social and economic well being. Unfortunately, nobody in power does. Why should they, after all? Nobody they interact with on a daily basis suffers the plight of the working class citizenry. Still, paid family leave, universal federal background checks, child tax credit, Medicare for all - these are all insanely popular policies which poll at 60-90%+ approval ratings. Why do the Dems refuse to run on these issues? Because their donors pay them not to.
It is not messaging. The messaging of conservatives is terrible too. It is about owning media to play the propaganda game. Policies are irrelevant, image is everything.
They vote opposite to that. I know it sounds elitist, but it is also factual: someone poor who votes for Trump votes against their interests and does so out of ignorance.
They don’t?. See, they did not shout their message loud enough if you haven’t heard it. There is not a single “identity politics” item, that’s how conservatives have framed this and that’s their message you imprinted.
So fuck the platform, the same would have happened with Sanders. The problem is that the message is not being placarded loud enough into social media, TV, newspapers, that not enough people get bribed to tell voters they are stupid if they don’t vote for dems.
The gloves should have been taken off a while ago. The battlefield is the widely ignorant voter population. Either you find a way to educate them or you accept to play the propaganda game.
You aren’t owed life, or shelter, food every day, or freedom from imprisonment from no reason. Or from torture. Nobody outside yourself has any obligation to create for you a system that you like.
We made all this up, all this justice, flawed or not. We create it every day. Except now it might be about to go away. We either get together and create and sustain it, or it can blow away like a fart in the wind.
That’s realpolitik. Welcome to it, and congratulations.
I agree with what you said in this block.
*Also to blame.
Not by all of us. I didn’t want her in 2020, either. She’s a glorified cop. Example: as a DA, how many people did she imprison for marijuana charges? But then she ran on legalization? I know there’s more to this and nuance is everything, but that hypocrisy is and example.
Applying the law but wanting it to change is what is called “rule of law” and democracy. Not understanding it is a part of what makes it so easy to slide into fascism.
“Nuance” my ass. Expecting a DA to follow its conviction instead of the law is the opposite of what you want.
That’s what I was getting at. Frankly, I wouldn’t want a DA or any cop-adjacent to run the country. Better her than the Orange Turd, but I’m splitting hairs here.
Anyone should have been a shoe-in against him. But they weren’t. She wasn’t. It wasn’t a single factor. We will scream until we’re blue in the face, pun intended, but in the end, the Dems fucked this.
The candidate they ran was not better than Trump at connecting with the populace. As a result, we got a false populist.
A female DA against a rapist who should be in jail. I don’t know in what universe it wasnt a good match.
Ours. You’re in it.