• Lvxferre@mander.xyz
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    4
    ·
    3 days ago

    I disagree that this is subjective. Even if someone hypothetically doesn’t accept the ZF[C], the statement still accurately describes reality, in a way that doesn’t depend on the subject. For example, you can’t start with two apples and two oranges and have five or tree fruits.

    • iii@mander.xyz
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      3
      ·
      edit-2
      3 days ago

      Yet in some contexts it isn’t as easy as that. You can combine 1 liter of water with 1 liter of alcohol, and get less than 2 liters of fluids. (1)

      • Lvxferre@mander.xyz
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        2
        ·
        3 days ago

        The volume of a mixture cannot be described by a simple sum of the volume of its components. As such, this does not make the statement “1+1=2” false in this situation; it’s still true but irrelevant, there’s no “+” here on first place.

        Additionally, let us suppose for a moment that the reasoning above is invalid. Even then, it’s still an objective matter - because then the truth value of “1+1=2” would vary depending on the object (are we dealing with apples, or liquid mixtures?), not on the subject (who’s mixing the liquids - you or me?).

        • iii@mander.xyz
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          2
          ·
          edit-2
          3 days ago

          It’s subjective as in: imagine a different society/species constructing a sense of reality and computation, based on liquid mixtures. Their basis of computation, their axiom is 1l of alcohol + 1l of water = 2l of mixture.

          They meet us, and we exchange ideas.

          They go: of course 1 + 1 = 2, look at our mixture. For fruits, apples and pears? That’s outside of normal arithmetics, it’s an exception. There’s no + there, as you’re not mixing. You have to correct for the non mixture nature, the answer will be larger than 2.