When he uses his official powers in any way, under the majority’s reasoning, he now will be insulated from criminal prosecution. Orders the Navy’s Seal Team 6 to assassinate a political rival? Immune. Organizes a military coup to hold onto power? Immune. Takes a bribe in exchange for a pardon? Immune. Immune, immune, immune
In all three of those cases, the question as to whether those actions are required or permitted under the law is put to a judge, and that judge is free to rule that they are not. The trial judge is free to rule that they are “unofficial” acts, and deny that immunity.
Use of the military is delegated to him under article 2, his use of that power cannot be questioned. The ruling says what you just described cannot happen. He has absolute immunity for anything he uses that power for. Appointing or firing officials? Article 2, cannot be questioned. Granting pardons? Article 2, cannot be questioned, doesn’t matter why he did it.
Only if the president is using some ability or power not specifically delegated in the constitution can a judge even began to decide if it counts as an official act. And then if that does, not quite as good as absolute immunity, but still presumptive immunity.
And it gets even worse! Anything the president did as an “official act” cannot be used against him in court as evidence. So much of the evidence in all the cases he has can no longer be used! If any of the charges survive at all in the first place given this ridiculously broad immunity ruling. This ruling is so bad it may even help him get out his state charges unexpectedly. There’s a slim chance some of the charges may live on, but the funny thing about the ruling is it gives even more criminal immunity to some the scariest things the president has the power to do.
If this ruling is terrible for Trump, why does the dissent start out by saying this gives everything Trump asked for and more?!
I’m sorry, but you’re just incorrect. Please just read the dissents from the actual constitutional scholars in the ruling though instead of my dumb internet comments trying to summarize. They explain it all much better and more thoroughly.
The first dissent starts on page 68 of the document I linked, and with the very large margins is a surprisingly quick read.
Use of the military is delegated to him under article 2, his use of that power cannot be questioned.
The military is strictly limited on what kind of operations it is allowed to perform. The commander and operators of Seal Team 6 would be prosecuted if they obeyed an unlawful order, even if it came from their Commander in Chief. The president does not have the power to order Seal Team 6 to violate the Posse Comitatus act. The President does not have the power to violate his political rival’s right to due process. A prosecutor can argue that such an egregious order falls well outside the scope of the office, and constitutes an “unofficial act”. The courts are free to rule accordingly.
The dissents are reading far more into the majority opinion than is actually there. I suggest you read the majority opinion a little more closely.
A prosecutor can argue that such an egregious order falls well outside the scope of the office, and constitutes an “unofficial act”.
Incorrect, according to this ruling, his use of the military has absolute immunity. It doesn’t matter what he’s doing with it, they can’t even question if it’s an official act or not. That only factors in when using powers not delegated in the constitution. You do point out some more absurdities in the majority’s ruling though, theoretically a court could hold troops accountable for unlawful orders but could not hold the executive accountable for giving them. Moot point though, who’s bringing the charges against the troops in this situation? President has absolute criminal immunity for hiring and firing, just fire any prosecutors whether that’s justice department or military justice if they try to do so.
The president does not have the power to order Seal Team 6 to violate the Posse Comitatus act.
Null and void, they specifically state that not only the court doesn’t have the power to question, neither does congress. The supreme court just made posse comitatus toilet paper.
The only way out for this mess is replacing the justices or a constitutional ammendment that’s says, yes we still have the rule of law for everyone, including the president.
And yes I read the whole thing. And if the majority can’t see what they have enabled they’re stupid. But I don’t think it’s stupidity, they’re smart people. That only leaves malice. Or some very different political ideals than I hold about the rule of law at least.
You’re right! Even easier. Article 2 power use again, cannot be questioned. Pre emptive pardons for everyone involved. We were all worried about the possibility of Trump self pardoning, but this court has made that possibility seem quaint in comparison to what they’ve bestowed.
In all three of those cases, the question as to whether those actions are required or permitted under the law is put to a judge, and that judge is free to rule that they are not. The trial judge is free to rule that they are “unofficial” acts, and deny that immunity.
This ruling is terrible for Trump.
Use of the military is delegated to him under article 2, his use of that power cannot be questioned. The ruling says what you just described cannot happen. He has absolute immunity for anything he uses that power for. Appointing or firing officials? Article 2, cannot be questioned. Granting pardons? Article 2, cannot be questioned, doesn’t matter why he did it.
Only if the president is using some ability or power not specifically delegated in the constitution can a judge even began to decide if it counts as an official act. And then if that does, not quite as good as absolute immunity, but still presumptive immunity.
And it gets even worse! Anything the president did as an “official act” cannot be used against him in court as evidence. So much of the evidence in all the cases he has can no longer be used! If any of the charges survive at all in the first place given this ridiculously broad immunity ruling. This ruling is so bad it may even help him get out his state charges unexpectedly. There’s a slim chance some of the charges may live on, but the funny thing about the ruling is it gives even more criminal immunity to some the scariest things the president has the power to do.
If this ruling is terrible for Trump, why does the dissent start out by saying this gives everything Trump asked for and more?!
I’m sorry, but you’re just incorrect. Please just read the dissents from the actual constitutional scholars in the ruling though instead of my dumb internet comments trying to summarize. They explain it all much better and more thoroughly.
The first dissent starts on page 68 of the document I linked, and with the very large margins is a surprisingly quick read.
The military is strictly limited on what kind of operations it is allowed to perform. The commander and operators of Seal Team 6 would be prosecuted if they obeyed an unlawful order, even if it came from their Commander in Chief. The president does not have the power to order Seal Team 6 to violate the Posse Comitatus act. The President does not have the power to violate his political rival’s right to due process. A prosecutor can argue that such an egregious order falls well outside the scope of the office, and constitutes an “unofficial act”. The courts are free to rule accordingly.
The dissents are reading far more into the majority opinion than is actually there. I suggest you read the majority opinion a little more closely.
Incorrect, according to this ruling, his use of the military has absolute immunity. It doesn’t matter what he’s doing with it, they can’t even question if it’s an official act or not. That only factors in when using powers not delegated in the constitution. You do point out some more absurdities in the majority’s ruling though, theoretically a court could hold troops accountable for unlawful orders but could not hold the executive accountable for giving them. Moot point though, who’s bringing the charges against the troops in this situation? President has absolute criminal immunity for hiring and firing, just fire any prosecutors whether that’s justice department or military justice if they try to do so.
Null and void, they specifically state that not only the court doesn’t have the power to question, neither does congress. The supreme court just made posse comitatus toilet paper.
The only way out for this mess is replacing the justices or a constitutional ammendment that’s says, yes we still have the rule of law for everyone, including the president.
And yes I read the whole thing. And if the majority can’t see what they have enabled they’re stupid. But I don’t think it’s stupidity, they’re smart people. That only leaves malice. Or some very different political ideals than I hold about the rule of law at least.
He could just preemptively/promise a pardon to all of seal team 6 / anyone in the military carrying out his orders.
You’re right! Even easier. Article 2 power use again, cannot be questioned. Pre emptive pardons for everyone involved. We were all worried about the possibility of Trump self pardoning, but this court has made that possibility seem quaint in comparison to what they’ve bestowed.